From: "Legacy, Allain" <Allain.Legacy@windriver.com>
To: Vincent JARDIN <vincent.jardin@6wind.com>,
"YIGIT, FERRUH" <ferruh.yigit@intel.com>
Cc: "Jolliffe, Ian" <Ian.Jolliffe@windriver.com>,
"jerin.jacob@caviumnetworks.com" <jerin.jacob@caviumnetworks.com>,
"stephen@networkplumber.org" <stephen@networkplumber.org>,
"thomas.monjalon@6wind.com" <thomas.monjalon@6wind.com>,
"dev@dpdk.org" <dev@dpdk.org>,
"WILES, ROGER" <roger.k.wiles@intel.com>
Subject: Re: [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 16/16] doc: adds information related to the AVP PMD
Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2017 19:17:31 +0000 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <70A7408C6E1BFB41B192A929744D8523968EE5D2@ALA-MBC.corp.ad.wrs.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <cac6551c-6778-6f4c-d7dc-417b4a9530f4@6wind.com>
Vincent,
Perhaps you can help me understand why the performance or functionality of AVP vs. Virtio is relevant to the decision of accepting this driver. There are many drivers in the DPDK; most of which provide the same functionality at comparable performance rates. AVP is just another such driver. The fact that it is virtual rather than physical, in my opinion, should not influence the decision of accepting this driver. On the other hand, code quality/complexity or lack of a maintainer are reasonable reasons for rejecting. If our driver is accepted we are committed to maintaining it and testing changes as required by any driver framework changes which may impact all drivers.
Along the same lines, I do not understand why upstreaming AVP in to the Linux kernel or qemu/kvm should be a prerequisite for inclusion in the DPDK. Continuing my analogy from above, the AVP device is a commercial offering tied to the Wind River Systems Titanium product line. It enables virtualized DPDK applications and increases DPDK adoption. Similarly to how a driver from company XYX is tied to a commercial NIC that must be purchased by a customer, our AVP device is available to operators that choose to leverage our Titanium product to implement their Cloud solutions. It is not our intention to upstream the qemu/kvm or host vswitch portion of the AVP device. Our qemu/kvm extensions are GPL so they are available to our customers if they desire to rebuild qemu/kvm with their own proprietary extensions
Our AVP device was implemented in 2013 in response to the challenge of lower than required performance of qemu/virtio in both user space and DPDK applications in the VM. Rather than making complex changes to qemu/virtio and continuously have to forward prop those as we upgraded to newer versions of qemu we decided to decouple ourselves from that code base. We developed the AVP device based on an evolution of KNI+ivshmem by enhancing both with features that would meet the needs of our customers; better performance, multi-queue support, live-migration support, hot-plug support. As I said in my earlier response, since 2013, qemu/virtio has seen improved performance with the introduction of vhost-user. The performance of vhost-user still has not yet achieved performance levels equal to our AVP PMD.
I acknowledge that the AVP driver could exist as an out-of-tree driver loaded as a shared library at runtime. In fact, 2 years ago we released our driver source on github for this very reason. We provide instructions and support for building the AVP PMD as a shared library. Some customers have adopted this method while many insist on an in-tree driver for several reasons.
Most importantly, they want to eliminate the burden of needing to build and support an additional package into their product. An in-tree driver would eliminate the need for a separate build/packaging process. Also, they want an option that allows them to be able to develop directly on the bleeding edge of DPDK rather than waiting on us to update our out-of-tree driver based on stable releases of the DPDK. In this regard, an in-tree driver would allow our customers to work directly on the latest DPDK.
An in-tree driver provides obvious benefits to our customers, but keep in mind that this also provides a benefit to the DPDK. If a customer must develop on a stable release because they must use an out-of-tree driver then they are less likely to contribute fixes/enhancements/testing upstream. I know this first hand because I work with software from different sources on a daily basis and it is a significant burden to have to reproduce/test fixes on master when you build/ship on an older stable release. Accepting this driver would increase the potential pool of developers available for contributions and reviews.
Again, we are committed to contributing to the DPDK community by supporting our driver and upstreaming other fixes/enhancements we develop along the way. We feel that if the DPDK is limited to only a single virtual driver of any type then choice and innovation is also limited. In the end if more variety and innovation increases DPDK adoption then this is a win for DPDK and everyone that is involved in the project.
Regards,
Allain
Allain Legacy, Software Developer
direct 613.270.2279 fax 613.492.7870 skype allain.legacy
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vincent JARDIN [mailto:vincent.jardin@6wind.com]
> Sent: Friday, March 03, 2017 11:22 AM
> To: Legacy, Allain; YIGIT, FERRUH
> Cc: Jolliffe, Ian; jerin.jacob@caviumnetworks.com;
> stephen@networkplumber.org; thomas.monjalon@6wind.com;
> dev@dpdk.org
> Subject: Re: [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 16/16] doc: adds information related to
> the AVP PMD
>
> Le 02/03/2017 à 01:20, Allain Legacy a écrit :
> > +Since the initial implementation of AVP devices, vhost-user has become
> > +part of the qemu offering with a significant performance increase over
> > +the original virtio implementation. However, vhost-user still does
> > +not achieve the level of performance that the AVP device can provide
> > +to our customers for DPDK based VM instances.
>
> Allain,
>
> please, can you be more explicit: why is virtio not fast enough?
>
> Moreover, why should we get another PMD for Qemu/kvm which is not
> virtio? There is not argument into your doc about it.
> NEC, before vhost-user, made a memnic proposal too because
> virtio/vhost-user was not available.
> Now, we all agree that vhost-user is the right way to support VMs, it
> avoids duplication of maintenances.
>
> Please add some arguments that explains why virtio should not be used,
> so others like memnic or avp should be.
>
> Regarding,
> + nova boot --flavor small --image my-image \
> + --nic net-id=${NETWORK1_UUID} \
> + --nic net-id=${NETWORK2_UUID},vif-model=avp \
> + --nic net-id=${NETWORK3_UUID},vif-model=avp \
> + --security-group default my-instance1
>
> I do not see how to get it working with vanilla nova. Please, I think
> you should rather show with qemu or virsh.
>
> Then, there is not such AVP netdevice into Linux kernel upstream. Before
> adding any AVP support, it should be added into legacy upstream so we
> can be sure that the APIs will be solid and won't need to be updated
> because of some kernel constraints.
>
> Thank you,
> Vincent
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2017-03-13 19:17 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 172+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2017-02-25 1:22 [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 00/16] Wind River Systems " Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 01/16] config: adds attributes for the " Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 02/16] net/avp: public header files Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 03/16] maintainers: claim responsibility for AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 04/16] net/avp: add PMD version map file Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 05/16] net/avp: debug log macros Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 06/16] drivers/net: adds driver makefiles for AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 07/16] net/avp: driver registration Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 08/16] net/avp: device initialization Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 09/16] net/avp: device configuration Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 10/16] net/avp: queue setup and release Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 11/16] net/avp: packet receive functions Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 12/16] net/avp: packet transmit functions Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 13/16] net/avp: device statistics operations Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 14/16] net/avp: device promiscuous functions Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 15/16] net/avp: device start and stop operations Allain Legacy
2017-02-25 1:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 16/16] doc: adds information related to the AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-02-26 19:08 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 00/16] Wind River Systems " Allain Legacy
2017-02-26 19:08 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 01/15] config: adds attributes for the " Allain Legacy
2017-02-26 19:08 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 02/15] net/avp: public header files Allain Legacy
2017-02-28 11:49 ` Jerin Jacob
2017-03-01 13:25 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-02-26 19:08 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 03/15] maintainers: claim responsibility for AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-02-26 19:08 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 04/15] net/avp: add PMD version map file Allain Legacy
2017-02-26 19:08 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 05/15] net/avp: debug log macros Allain Legacy
2017-02-26 19:08 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 06/15] drivers/net: adds driver makefiles for AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-02-26 19:08 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 07/15] net/avp: driver registration Allain Legacy
2017-02-27 16:47 ` Stephen Hemminger
2017-02-27 17:10 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-02-27 16:53 ` Stephen Hemminger
2017-02-27 17:09 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-02-26 19:08 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 08/15] net/avp: device initialization Allain Legacy
2017-02-28 11:57 ` Jerin Jacob
2017-03-01 13:29 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-02-26 19:08 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 09/15] net/avp: device configuration Allain Legacy
2017-02-26 19:08 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 10/15] net/avp: queue setup and release Allain Legacy
2017-02-26 19:08 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 11/15] net/avp: packet receive functions Allain Legacy
2017-02-27 16:46 ` Stephen Hemminger
2017-02-27 17:06 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-02-28 10:27 ` Bruce Richardson
2017-03-01 13:23 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-03-01 14:14 ` Thomas Monjalon
2017-03-01 14:54 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-03-01 15:10 ` Stephen Hemminger
2017-03-01 15:40 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-02-26 19:09 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 12/15] net/avp: packet transmit functions Allain Legacy
2017-02-26 22:18 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-02-26 19:09 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 13/15] net/avp: device promiscuous functions Allain Legacy
2017-02-26 19:09 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 14/15] net/avp: device start and stop operations Allain Legacy
2017-02-26 19:09 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 15/15] doc: adds information related to the AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-02-27 17:04 ` Mcnamara, John
2017-02-27 17:07 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-02-27 8:54 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 00/16] Wind River Systems " Vincent JARDIN
2017-02-27 12:15 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-02-27 15:17 ` Wiles, Keith
2017-03-02 0:19 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 " Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:19 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 01/16] config: adds attributes for the " Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:19 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 02/16] net/avp: public header files Allain Legacy
2017-03-03 14:37 ` Chas Williams
2017-03-03 15:35 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-03-02 0:19 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 03/16] maintainers: claim responsibility for AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:19 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 04/16] net/avp: add PMD version map file Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:19 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 05/16] net/avp: debug log macros Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:19 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 06/16] drivers/net: adds driver makefiles for AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:19 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 07/16] net/avp: driver registration Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:20 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 08/16] net/avp: device initialization Allain Legacy
2017-03-03 15:04 ` Chas Williams
2017-03-09 14:03 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-03-09 14:48 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-03-02 0:20 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 09/16] net/avp: device configuration Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:20 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 10/16] net/avp: queue setup and release Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:20 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 11/16] net/avp: packet receive functions Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:20 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 12/16] net/avp: packet transmit functions Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:20 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 13/16] net/avp: device statistics operations Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:35 ` Stephen Hemminger
2017-03-09 13:48 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-03-02 0:20 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 14/16] net/avp: device promiscuous functions Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:20 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 15/16] net/avp: device start and stop operations Allain Legacy
2017-03-02 0:37 ` Stephen Hemminger
2017-03-09 13:49 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-03-02 0:20 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 16/16] doc: adds information related to the AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-03-03 16:21 ` Vincent JARDIN
2017-03-13 19:17 ` Legacy, Allain [this message]
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 00/17] Wind River Systems " Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 01/17] config: adds attributes for the " Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 02/17] net/avp: public header files Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 03/17] maintainers: claim responsibility for AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 04/17] net/avp: add PMD version map file Allain Legacy
2017-03-16 14:52 ` Ferruh Yigit
2017-03-16 15:33 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 05/17] net/avp: debug log macros Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 06/17] drivers/net: adds driver makefiles for AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 07/17] net/avp: driver registration Allain Legacy
2017-03-16 14:53 ` Ferruh Yigit
2017-03-16 15:37 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 08/17] net/avp: device initialization Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 09/17] net/avp: device configuration Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 10/17] net/avp: queue setup and release Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 11/17] net/avp: packet receive functions Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 12/17] net/avp: packet transmit functions Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 13/17] net/avp: device statistics operations Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 14/17] net/avp: device promiscuous functions Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 15/17] net/avp: device start and stop operations Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 16/17] net/avp: migration interrupt handling Allain Legacy
2017-03-13 19:16 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 17/17] doc: adds information related to the AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-03-16 14:53 ` Ferruh Yigit
2017-03-16 15:37 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-03-14 17:37 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 00/17] Wind River Systems AVP PMD vs virtio? Vincent JARDIN
2017-03-15 4:10 ` O'Driscoll, Tim
2017-03-15 10:55 ` Thomas Monjalon
2017-03-15 14:02 ` Vincent JARDIN
2017-03-16 3:18 ` O'Driscoll, Tim
2017-03-16 8:52 ` Francois Ozog
2017-03-16 9:51 ` Wiles, Keith
2017-03-16 10:32 ` Chas Williams
2017-03-16 18:09 ` Francois Ozog
2017-03-15 11:29 ` Ferruh Yigit
2017-03-15 14:08 ` Vincent JARDIN
2017-03-15 18:18 ` Ferruh Yigit
2017-03-15 14:02 ` Vincent JARDIN
2017-03-15 14:02 ` Vincent JARDIN
2017-03-15 20:19 ` Wiles, Keith
2017-03-16 23:17 ` Stephen Hemminger
2017-03-16 23:41 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 00/17] Wind River Systems AVP PMD vs virtio? - ivshmem is back Vincent JARDIN
2017-03-17 0:08 ` Wiles, Keith
2017-03-17 0:15 ` O'Driscoll, Tim
2017-03-17 0:11 ` Wiles, Keith
2017-03-17 0:14 ` Stephen Hemminger
2017-03-17 0:31 ` Vincent JARDIN
2017-03-17 0:53 ` Wiles, Keith
2017-03-17 8:48 ` Thomas Monjalon
2017-03-17 10:15 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-03-17 13:52 ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2017-03-20 22:30 ` Hobywan Kenoby
2017-03-21 11:06 ` Thomas Monjalon
[not found] ` <20170317093320.GA11116@stefanha-x1.localdomain>
2017-03-30 8:55 ` Markus Armbruster
2017-03-23 11:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 00/14] Wind River Systems AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 01/14] drivers/net: adds AVP PMD base files Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 02/14] net/avp: public header files Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 03/14] net/avp: debug log macros Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 04/14] net/avp: driver registration Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 05/14] net/avp: device initialization Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 06/14] net/avp: device configuration Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 07/14] net/avp: queue setup and release Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 08/14] net/avp: packet receive functions Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 09/14] net/avp: packet transmit functions Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 10/14] net/avp: device statistics operations Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 11/14] net/avp: device promiscuous functions Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 12/14] net/avp: device start and stop operations Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 13/14] net/avp: migration interrupt handling Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 11:24 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 14/14] doc: adds information related to the AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-03-23 14:18 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 00/14] Wind River Systems " Ferruh Yigit
2017-03-23 18:28 ` Legacy, Allain
2017-03-23 20:35 ` Vincent Jardin
2017-03-28 11:53 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 " Allain Legacy
2017-03-28 11:53 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 01/14] drivers/net: adds AVP PMD base files Allain Legacy
2017-03-28 11:53 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 02/14] net/avp: public header files Allain Legacy
2017-03-28 11:53 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 03/14] net/avp: debug log macros Allain Legacy
2017-03-28 11:53 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 04/14] net/avp: driver registration Allain Legacy
2017-03-28 11:54 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 05/14] net/avp: device initialization Allain Legacy
2017-03-28 11:54 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 06/14] net/avp: device configuration Allain Legacy
2017-03-29 10:28 ` Ferruh Yigit
2017-03-28 11:54 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 07/14] net/avp: queue setup and release Allain Legacy
2017-03-28 11:54 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 08/14] net/avp: packet receive functions Allain Legacy
2017-03-28 11:54 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 09/14] net/avp: packet transmit functions Allain Legacy
2017-03-28 11:54 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 10/14] net/avp: device statistics operations Allain Legacy
2017-03-28 11:54 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 11/14] net/avp: device promiscuous functions Allain Legacy
2017-03-28 11:54 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 12/14] net/avp: device start and stop operations Allain Legacy
2017-03-28 11:54 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 13/14] net/avp: migration interrupt handling Allain Legacy
2017-03-28 11:54 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 14/14] doc: adds information related to the AVP PMD Allain Legacy
2017-03-29 10:44 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 00/14] Wind River Systems " Vincent JARDIN
2017-03-29 11:05 ` Ferruh Yigit
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