From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-pl1-f181.google.com (mail-pl1-f181.google.com [209.85.214.181]) by dpdk.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 837951B433 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2019 17:51:30 +0200 (CEST) Received: by mail-pl1-f181.google.com with SMTP id m10so1361868plt.10 for ; Thu, 04 Apr 2019 08:51:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=networkplumber-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=3C9rC9HDSyirXrANHoR43UI0tBzvd71mmc4809KIgxo=; b=LOrs6HC7BgvK0EnW1NqSzprT8FBUMXGBkgLErLVSKvzjlRuTqlmUx2BNqj9q3aJAVZ DIvUeAo58l4g9N0ZfGA46NVHIay6zENwDxR4O2zRowpzz4IvwuNpEujBMocEv1/X6fvx EVDPk6DpjrU0cKQKNbr4zU6y04GojTmaHXfDyed96PzuqfPNrC3bNcKzZ2RO2ZSkn6Ql QYh+WOzQRrCWwD8RbNeDkikQWyT8KcTVFXs2yqHqrhnH/Y8bjTzlXhJEd0nAImdUbInG 3YlyrESuNOKOsP5WuqzrnOLUT37Kp1OIcBLiMjVOZwnFurVC3p03seK5jt3ytQLfvfoH fw/Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to :references:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=3C9rC9HDSyirXrANHoR43UI0tBzvd71mmc4809KIgxo=; b=OkeKxAcEFtb9NdjXDIG8XOmxnQ/xoUM/3F22GjEv4YmIECxIXaxHgGDd09sq+LglIu fT1RfDKmQz+HBAxsHBe5mBsR5WU4tFfZ50ZPtZP2PsFVbkondczxL4h2BQLXGHUfQWzg 7iG6FTPguCwUASyuuCnNlHJgFFGJqFwTQZ33cYQmLabaEZkhmw0i+TWGmHOAojArEKv2 wGLZL4w0dyfwxdOyYvh6+XNOUsJhvh0jYDPmR6Ee8sq8fT4Ap24YtXVE9WSJLwu1HVfZ vBoIlerB62Yo+klDf965bHQu82QWeLcmXTjDZEC+TSKh/GIGrx+D0++cry/ljRr5Bbp8 GRCA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWym1a/B7VVM3mMWEUyr0kLBfsW+eYC2p8RE6YmWo3ns+wSEowP U2RSW27euQmKP1QdFieujRkCNg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyFYSb24GPRKe86ZjXbBjRmlWHZhCLoWLjfnTj3IOmlq56vzZaH4i2exWoVfMdrSifnw6muJw== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:9043:: with SMTP id w3mr7206205plz.101.1554393089538; Thu, 04 Apr 2019 08:51:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shemminger-XPS-13-9360 ([167.220.100.121]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id g73sm36903130pfd.185.2019.04.04.08.51.29 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Thu, 04 Apr 2019 08:51:29 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2019 08:51:27 -0700 From: Stephen Hemminger To: Bruce Richardson Cc: "Burakov, Anatoly" , Ray Kinsella , dev@dpdk.org, Kevin Traynor , "techboard@dpdk.org" Message-ID: <20190404085127.24d02988@shemminger-XPS-13-9360> In-Reply-To: <20190404105447.GA1351@bricha3-MOBL.ger.corp.intel.com> References: <94df3cc4-de54-72d6-84c6-81bebd209a81@intel.com> <20190404105447.GA1351@bricha3-MOBL.ger.corp.intel.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [dpdk-dev] [dpdk-techboard] DPDK ABI/API Stability X-BeenThere: dev@dpdk.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: DPDK patches and discussions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 04 Apr 2019 15:51:31 -0000 On Thu, 4 Apr 2019 11:54:47 +0100 Bruce Richardson wrote: > My thoughts on the matter are: > 1. I think we really need to do work to start hiding more of our data > structures - like what Stephen's latest RFC does. This hiding should reduce > the scope for ABI breaks. > 2. Once done, I think we should commit to having an ABI break only in the > rarest of circumstances, and only with very large justification. I want us > to get to the point where DPDK releases can immediately be picked up by all > linux distros and rolled out because they are ABI compatible. I would also like to propose "you get one ABI break" which means each API/ABI change must hide more infrastructure than the last. This is the "fool me once, ..." saying in API's. For example, the memory rework it would have been good if the structure of mempools etc were hidden inside EAL and not exposed. but as usual hindsight is 20/20 From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from dpdk.org (dpdk.org [92.243.14.124]) by dpdk.space (Postfix) with ESMTP id A510AA0679 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2019 17:51:34 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [92.243.14.124] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dpdk.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBDCB1B438; Thu, 4 Apr 2019 17:51:32 +0200 (CEST) Received: from mail-pl1-f181.google.com (mail-pl1-f181.google.com [209.85.214.181]) by dpdk.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 837951B433 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2019 17:51:30 +0200 (CEST) Received: by mail-pl1-f181.google.com with SMTP id m10so1361868plt.10 for ; Thu, 04 Apr 2019 08:51:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=networkplumber-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=3C9rC9HDSyirXrANHoR43UI0tBzvd71mmc4809KIgxo=; b=LOrs6HC7BgvK0EnW1NqSzprT8FBUMXGBkgLErLVSKvzjlRuTqlmUx2BNqj9q3aJAVZ DIvUeAo58l4g9N0ZfGA46NVHIay6zENwDxR4O2zRowpzz4IvwuNpEujBMocEv1/X6fvx EVDPk6DpjrU0cKQKNbr4zU6y04GojTmaHXfDyed96PzuqfPNrC3bNcKzZ2RO2ZSkn6Ql QYh+WOzQRrCWwD8RbNeDkikQWyT8KcTVFXs2yqHqrhnH/Y8bjTzlXhJEd0nAImdUbInG 3YlyrESuNOKOsP5WuqzrnOLUT37Kp1OIcBLiMjVOZwnFurVC3p03seK5jt3ytQLfvfoH fw/Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to :references:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=3C9rC9HDSyirXrANHoR43UI0tBzvd71mmc4809KIgxo=; b=OkeKxAcEFtb9NdjXDIG8XOmxnQ/xoUM/3F22GjEv4YmIECxIXaxHgGDd09sq+LglIu fT1RfDKmQz+HBAxsHBe5mBsR5WU4tFfZ50ZPtZP2PsFVbkondczxL4h2BQLXGHUfQWzg 7iG6FTPguCwUASyuuCnNlHJgFFGJqFwTQZ33cYQmLabaEZkhmw0i+TWGmHOAojArEKv2 wGLZL4w0dyfwxdOyYvh6+XNOUsJhvh0jYDPmR6Ee8sq8fT4Ap24YtXVE9WSJLwu1HVfZ vBoIlerB62Yo+klDf965bHQu82QWeLcmXTjDZEC+TSKh/GIGrx+D0++cry/ljRr5Bbp8 GRCA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWym1a/B7VVM3mMWEUyr0kLBfsW+eYC2p8RE6YmWo3ns+wSEowP U2RSW27euQmKP1QdFieujRkCNg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyFYSb24GPRKe86ZjXbBjRmlWHZhCLoWLjfnTj3IOmlq56vzZaH4i2exWoVfMdrSifnw6muJw== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:9043:: with SMTP id w3mr7206205plz.101.1554393089538; Thu, 04 Apr 2019 08:51:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shemminger-XPS-13-9360 ([167.220.100.121]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id g73sm36903130pfd.185.2019.04.04.08.51.29 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Thu, 04 Apr 2019 08:51:29 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2019 08:51:27 -0700 From: Stephen Hemminger To: Bruce Richardson Cc: "Burakov, Anatoly" , Ray Kinsella , dev@dpdk.org, Kevin Traynor , "techboard@dpdk.org" Message-ID: <20190404085127.24d02988@shemminger-XPS-13-9360> In-Reply-To: <20190404105447.GA1351@bricha3-MOBL.ger.corp.intel.com> References: <94df3cc4-de54-72d6-84c6-81bebd209a81@intel.com> <20190404105447.GA1351@bricha3-MOBL.ger.corp.intel.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [dpdk-dev] [dpdk-techboard] DPDK ABI/API Stability X-BeenThere: dev@dpdk.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: DPDK patches and discussions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dev-bounces@dpdk.org Sender: "dev" Message-ID: <20190404155127.8L10vcT28UbNcAlz-C2TAUoYpoyoldKUEdc9BPRkNgQ@z> On Thu, 4 Apr 2019 11:54:47 +0100 Bruce Richardson wrote: > My thoughts on the matter are: > 1. I think we really need to do work to start hiding more of our data > structures - like what Stephen's latest RFC does. This hiding should reduce > the scope for ABI breaks. > 2. Once done, I think we should commit to having an ABI break only in the > rarest of circumstances, and only with very large justification. I want us > to get to the point where DPDK releases can immediately be picked up by all > linux distros and rolled out because they are ABI compatible. I would also like to propose "you get one ABI break" which means each API/ABI change must hide more infrastructure than the last. This is the "fool me once, ..." saying in API's. For example, the memory rework it would have been good if the structure of mempools etc were hidden inside EAL and not exposed. but as usual hindsight is 20/20