From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mx1.redhat.com (mx1.redhat.com [209.132.183.28]) by dpdk.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4523AE72 for ; Wed, 6 May 2015 10:12:32 +0200 (CEST) Received: from int-mx09.intmail.prod.int.phx2.redhat.com (int-mx09.intmail.prod.int.phx2.redhat.com [10.5.11.22]) by mx1.redhat.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id t468CUWK029843 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 6 May 2015 04:12:31 -0400 Received: from localhost.localdomain (vpn1-5-36.ams2.redhat.com [10.36.5.36]) by int-mx09.intmail.prod.int.phx2.redhat.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id t468CTjS020075; Wed, 6 May 2015 04:12:29 -0400 Message-ID: <5549CCEC.8090606@redhat.com> Date: Wed, 06 May 2015 11:12:28 +0300 From: Panu Matilainen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Wiles, Keith" , Neil Horman References: <20150501164512.GB27756@hmsreliant.think-freely.org> <20150501173108.GA24714@mhcomputing.net> <533710CFB86FA344BFBF2D6802E602860466B524@SHSMSX101.ccr.corp.intel.com> <20150504174857.GA27496@mhcomputing.net> <924D0FD1-4A1F-4C3E-929C-38C29AED61D7@netgate.com>, <20150505135542.GB27259@hmsreliant.think-freely.org> <0CA4031C-561F-4BB9-8B14-674D6D99EE6E@intel.com> In-Reply-To: <0CA4031C-561F-4BB9-8B14-674D6D99EE6E@intel.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.68 on 10.5.11.22 Cc: "dev@dpdk.org" Subject: Re: [dpdk-dev] GitHub sandbox for the DPDK community X-BeenThere: dev@dpdk.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: patches and discussions about DPDK List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 06 May 2015 08:12:32 -0000 On 05/05/2015 07:43 PM, Wiles, Keith wrote: > > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On May 5, 2015, at 6:56 AM, Neil Horman wrote: >> >>> On Mon, May 04, 2015 at 10:25:00PM -0500, Jim Thompson wrote: >>> >>>> On May 4, 2015, at 10:12 PM, Wiles, Keith wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> On 5/4/15, 10:48 AM, "Matthew Hall" wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, May 04, 2015 at 12:43:48PM +0000, Qiu, Michael wrote: >>>>>> What mail client do you use? I think mail client supporting thread mode >>>>>> is important for patch review. >>>>> >>>>> Like many UNIX people, I use mutt. >>>>> >>>>> My concern is that, if we're making the widespread adoption, usage, and >>>>> contributions for DPDK dependent on selection or debate of the features >>>>> of >>>>> various MUAs, I'm not sure that we're looking at this from the right >>>>> angle. >>>>> >>>>> I'm just trying to figure out how to get DPDK in the place where the most >>>>> eyeballs are, rather than trying to drag the eyeballs to the place where >>>>> DPDK >>>>> is. >>>> >>>> +1, I agree with this statement completely and I feel discussions about an >>>> MUA is non-productive and out of scope. >>> >>> +1. I’ve avoided the whole discussion, because … ok, “non-productive and out of scope” is a polite way of saying it. >>> >>> jim >> >> Very well, since you seem to want to avoid talking about ways to get what you >> want in a workflow, lets go back to where the conversation started: >> >> http://dpdk.org/ml/archives/dev/2015-May/017225.html >> >> We got into this debate because you wanted to move the project to github, and as >> supporting reasons, listed a plethora of features that you liked about the site. >> This entire subtread has been meant to illustrate how you can have the features >> you want that you see as adventageous in the github environment without actualy >> moving to github. We've focused on email quote collapsing because we kept >> responding to one another, though I'm sure we could have the same debate on any >> one of the workflow features github offers. >> >> Can we all agree then, that for the list posted in your email above, any github >> environmental feature can be recreated with proper tooling, available today, >> without forcing the github environment on everybody? Further, can we agree >> that, given that those features are not unique to github, they are not >> compelling reasons to move the project there? > > Neil (I had to type this on my phone so please forgive any typos or > other statements that may sound odd. I am not trying to be rude in anyway) Somewhat OT but if you feel a disclaimer like this is required, would it not be better to let the response wait a few hours (or even a day or two) until you get back to a real computer? Especially since the matter is not actually urgent but just an ongoing discussion on a mailing list that is likely to continue for days or weeks to come. > > I feel you are taking everything out of context here. The email > client being able collapse threads is not the point here and I have > tried to redirect you politely to the points moving DPDK to github. Well perhaps there's also a point between the lines: many people (myself included) prefer email with the MUA of their choice as *the* tool for these tasks over some web interface that changes every now and then at somebody elses whim. But certainly many != all. > As I and others have pointed out GitHub offers a huge number eyes > for DPDK community. I dont know - how does moving a tree into a forest make it more visible? Well, to some of the other trees in the forest yes. Maybe there's a social networking aspect to this which I dont understand, I'm just a grumpy old-schooler. But if I need to find something, be it software or something else, I go to Google not GitHub (or SourceForge before that). > GitHub offers a different set of processes and > tools, which we do not have to create. Moving to GitHub is a change > for the community and I feel a good change for the better. Like quite a few others in this thread, I dont care if the git repo moved to the end of internet as long as email continues to be a first-class means for patch submissions, reviews and other communication. It doesn't have to be the only way as clearly many people prefer otherwise. [...] > > I do not want to split the DPDK community or try alienating any one. Forcing a change of tools and workflows on everybody WILL create ill-will if nothing else. Also please realize that not everybody sees GitHub as the greatest thing since sliced bread. It has quite some "Hotel California" aspects to it, and actually the imago of an average GH project is not that great: there are so many badly run and abandoned projects there that the first thought when I hear the word GitHub is "oh no, not one of those again" rather than "cool". I know I'm not alone in that thinking. - Panu -