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From: Andrew Rybchenko <andrew.rybchenko@oktetlabs.ru>
To: Thomas Monjalon <thomas@monjalon.net>,
	Ivan Malov <Ivan.Malov@oktetlabs.ru>
Cc: dev@dpdk.org, Andy Moreton <amoreton@xilinx.com>,
	orika@nvidia.com, ferruh.yigit@intel.com, olivier.matz@6wind.com
Subject: Re: [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 0/5] A means to negotiate delivery of Rx meta data
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 12:17:23 +0300
Message-ID: <b097b9c7-bf25-bac2-5749-88d10ec5f63e@oktetlabs.ru> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1769631.gUYDzmcafU@thomas>

On 10/1/21 3:10 PM, Thomas Monjalon wrote:
> 01/10/2021 12:15, Andrew Rybchenko:
>> On 10/1/21 12:48 PM, Thomas Monjalon wrote:
>>> 01/10/2021 10:55, Ivan Malov:
>>>> On 01/10/2021 11:11, Thomas Monjalon wrote:
>>>>> 01/10/2021 08:47, Andrew Rybchenko:
>>>>>> On 9/30/21 10:30 PM, Ivan Malov wrote:
>>>>>>> On 30/09/2021 19:18, Thomas Monjalon wrote:
>>>>>>>> 23/09/2021 13:20, Ivan Malov:
>>>>>>>>> Patch [1/5] of this series adds a generic API to let applications
>>>>>>>>> negotiate delivery of Rx meta data during initialisation period.
>>>>>
>>>>> What is a metadata?
>>>>> Do you mean RTE_FLOW_ITEM_TYPE_META and RTE_FLOW_ITEM_TYPE_MARK?
>>>>> Metadata word could cover any field in the mbuf struct so it is vague.
>>>>
>>>> Metadata here is *any* additional information provided by the NIC for 
>>>> each received packet. For example, Rx flag, Rx mark, RSS hash, packet 
>>>> classification info, you name it. I'd like to stress out that the 
>>>> suggested API comes with flags each of which is crystal clear on what 
>>>> concrete kind of metadata it covers, eg. Rx mark.
>>>
>>> I missed the flags.
>>> You mean these 3 flags?
>>
>> Yes
>>
>>> +/** The ethdev sees flagged packets if there are flows with action FLAG. */
>>> +#define RTE_ETH_RX_META_USER_FLAG (UINT64_C(1) << 0)
>>> +
>>> +/** The ethdev sees mark IDs in packets if there are flows with action MARK. */
>>> +#define RTE_ETH_RX_META_USER_MARK (UINT64_C(1) << 1)
>>> +
>>> +/** The ethdev detects missed packets if there are "tunnel_set" flows in use. */
>>> +#define RTE_ETH_RX_META_TUNNEL_ID (UINT64_C(1) << 2)
>>>
>>> It is not crystal clear because it does not reference the API,
>>> like RTE_FLOW_ACTION_TYPE_MARK.
>>
>> Thanks, it is easy to fix. Please, note that there is no action
>> for tunnel ID case.
> 
> I don't understand the tunnel ID meta.
> Is it an existing offload? API?

rte_flow_tunnel_*() API and "Tunneled traffic offload" in flow
API documentation.

> 
>>> And it covers a limited set of metadata.
>>
>> Yes which are not covered by offloads, packet classification
>> etc. Anything else?
>>
>>> Do you intend to extend to all mbuf metadata?
>>
>> No. It should be discussed case-by-case separately.
> 
> Ah, it makes the intent clearer.
> Why not planning to do something truly generic?

IMHO, it is generic enough for the purpose.

> 
>>>>>>>>> This way, an application knows right from the start which parts
>>>>>>>>> of Rx meta data won't be delivered. Hence, no necessity to try
>>>>>>>>> inserting flows requesting such data and handle the failures.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sorry I don't understand the problem you want to solve.
>>>>>>>> And sorry for not noticing earlier.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> No worries. *Some* PMDs do not enable delivery of, say, Rx mark with the
>>>>>>> packets by default (for performance reasons). If the application tries
>>>>>>> to insert a flow with action MARK, the PMD may not be able to enable
>>>>>>> delivery of Rx mark without the need to re-start Rx sub-system. And
>>>>>>> that's fraught with traffic disruption and similar bad consequences. In
>>>>>>> order to address it, we need to let the application express its interest
>>>>>>> in receiving mark with packets as early as possible. This way, the PMD
>>>>>>> can enable Rx mark delivery in advance. And, as an additional benefit,
>>>>>>> the application can learn *from the very beginning* whether it will be
>>>>>>> possible to use the feature or not. If this API tells the application
>>>>>>> that no mark delivery will be enabled, then the application can just
>>>>>>> skip many unnecessary attempts to insert wittingly unsupported flows
>>>>>>> during runtime.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm puzzled, because we could have the same reasoning for any offload.
>>>>
>>>> We're not discussing *offloads*. An offload is when NIC *computes 
>>>> something* and *delivers* it. We are discussing precisely *delivery*.
>>>
>>> OK but still, there are a lot more mbuf metadata delivered.
>>
>> Yes, and some are not controlled yet early enough, and
>> we do here.
>>
>>>
>>>>> I don't understand why we are focusing on mark only
>>>>
>>>> We are not focusing on mark on purpose. It's just how our discussion 
>>>> goes. I chose mark (could've chosen flag or anything else) just to show 
>>>> you an example.
>>>>
>>>>> I would prefer we find a generic solution using the rte_flow API. > Can we make rte_flow_validate() working before port start?
>>>>> If validating a fake rule doesn't make sense,
>>>>> why not having a new function accepting a single action as parameter?
>>>>
>>>> A noble idea, but if we feed the entire flow rule to the driver for 
>>>> validation, then the driver must not look specifically for actions FLAG 
>>>> or MARK in it (to enable or disable metadata delivery). This way, the 
>>>> driver is obliged to also validate match criteria, attributes, etc. And, 
>>>> if something is unsupported (say, some specific item), the driver will 
>>>> have to reject the rule as a whole thus leaving the application to join 
>>>> the dots itself.
>>>>
>>>> Say, you ask the driver to validate the following rule:
>>>> pattern blah-blah-1 / blah-blah-2 / end action flag / end
>>>> intending to check support for FLAG delivery. Suppose, the driver 
>>>> doesn't support pattern item "blah-blah-1". It will throw an error right 
>>>> after seeing this unsupported item and won't even go further to see the 
>>>> action FLAG. How can application know whether its request for FLAG was 
>>>> heard or not?
>>>
>>> No, I'm proposing a new function to validate the action alone,
>>> without any match etc.
>>> Example:
>>> 	rte_flow_action_request(RTE_FLOW_ACTION_TYPE_MARK)

Also, please, note that sometimes it makes sense to
use action MARK on transfer level, match it in flow
rules in non-transfer level, but do not require
deliver the mark to host.

>>
>> When about tunnel ID?
>>
>> Also negotiation in terms of bitmask natively allows to
>> provide everything required at once and it simplifies
>> implementation in the driver. No dependency on order of
>> checks etc. Also it allows to renegotiate without any
>> extra API functions.
> 
> You mean there is a single function call with all bits set?

Yes, but not all, but required bits set.

> 
>>>> And I'd not bind delivery of metadata to flow API. Consider the 
>>>> following example. We have a DPDK application sitting at the *host* and 
>>>> we have a *guest* with its *own* DPDK instance. The guest DPDK has asked 
>>>> the NIC (by virtue of flow API) to mark all outgoing packets. This 
>>>> packets reach the *host* DPDK. Say, the host application just wants to 
>>>> see the marked packets from the guest. Its own, (the host's) use of flow 
>>>> API is a don't care here. The host doesn't want to mark packets itself, 
>>>> it wants to see packets marked by the guest.
>>>
>>> It does not make sense to me. We are talking about a DPDK API.
>>> My concern is to avoid redefining new flags
>>> while we already have rte_flow actions.
>>
>> See above.
> 


  reply	other threads:[~2021-10-04  9:17 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 97+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-09-02 14:23 [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 0/5] A means to negotiate support for Rx meta information Ivan Malov
2021-09-02 14:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 1/5] ethdev: add API " Ivan Malov
2021-09-02 14:47   ` Jerin Jacob
2021-09-02 16:14   ` Kinsella, Ray
2021-09-03  9:34   ` Jerin Jacob
2021-09-02 14:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 2/5] net/sfc: provide API to negotiate supported Rx meta features Ivan Malov
2021-09-02 14:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 3/5] net/sfc: allow to use EF100 native datapath Rx mark in flows Ivan Malov
2021-09-02 14:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 4/5] common/sfc_efx/base: add RxQ flag to use Rx prefix user flag Ivan Malov
2021-09-02 14:23 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH 5/5] net/sfc: allow to discern user flag on EF100 native datapath Ivan Malov
2021-09-03  0:15 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 0/5] A means to negotiate support for Rx meta information Ivan Malov
2021-09-03  0:15   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 1/5] ethdev: add API " Ivan Malov
2021-09-03  0:15   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 2/5] net/sfc: provide API to negotiate supported Rx meta features Ivan Malov
2021-09-03  0:15   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 3/5] net/sfc: allow to use EF100 native datapath Rx mark in flows Ivan Malov
2021-09-03  0:15   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 4/5] common/sfc_efx/base: add RxQ flag to use Rx prefix user flag Ivan Malov
2021-09-03  0:15   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v2 5/5] net/sfc: allow to discern user flag on EF100 native datapath Ivan Malov
2021-09-23 11:20 ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 0/5] A means to negotiate delivery of Rx meta data Ivan Malov
2021-09-23 11:20   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 1/5] ethdev: add API " Ivan Malov
2021-09-30 14:59     ` Ori Kam
2021-09-30 15:07       ` Andrew Rybchenko
2021-09-30 19:07       ` Ivan Malov
2021-10-01  6:50         ` Andrew Rybchenko
2021-10-03  7:42           ` Ori Kam
2021-10-03  9:30             ` Ivan Malov
2021-10-03 11:01               ` Ori Kam
2021-10-03 17:30                 ` Ivan Malov
2021-10-03 21:04                   ` Ori Kam
2021-10-03 23:50                     ` Ivan Malov
2021-10-04  6:56                       ` Ori Kam
2021-10-04 11:39                         ` Ivan Malov
2021-10-04 13:53                           ` Andrew Rybchenko
2021-10-05  6:30                             ` Ori Kam
2021-10-05  7:27                               ` Andrew Rybchenko
2021-10-05  8:17                                 ` Ori Kam
2021-10-05  8:38                                   ` Andrew Rybchenko
2021-10-05  9:41                                     ` Ori Kam
2021-10-05 10:01                                       ` Andrew Rybchenko
2021-10-05 10:10                                         ` Ori Kam
2021-10-05 11:11                                           ` Andrew Rybchenko
2021-10-06  8:30                                             ` Thomas Monjalon
2021-10-06  8:38                                               ` Andrew Rybchenko
2021-10-06  9:14                                                 ` Ori Kam
2021-09-30 21:48     ` Ajit Khaparde
2021-09-30 22:00       ` Ivan Malov
2021-09-30 22:12         ` Ajit Khaparde
2021-09-30 22:22           ` Ivan Malov
2021-10-03  7:05             ` Ori Kam
2021-09-23 11:20   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 2/5] net/sfc: support " Ivan Malov
2021-09-23 11:20   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 3/5] net/sfc: support flow mark delivery on EF100 native datapath Ivan Malov
2021-09-23 11:20   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 4/5] common/sfc_efx/base: add RxQ flag to use Rx prefix user flag Ivan Malov
2021-09-23 11:20   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 5/5] net/sfc: report user flag on EF100 native datapath Ivan Malov
2021-09-30 16:18   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v3 0/5] A means to negotiate delivery of Rx meta data Thomas Monjalon
2021-09-30 19:30     ` Ivan Malov
2021-10-01  6:47       ` Andrew Rybchenko
2021-10-01  8:11         ` Thomas Monjalon
2021-10-01  8:54           ` Andrew Rybchenko
2021-10-01  9:32             ` Thomas Monjalon
2021-10-01  9:41               ` Andrew Rybchenko
2021-10-01  8:55           ` Ivan Malov
2021-10-01  9:48             ` Thomas Monjalon
2021-10-01 10:15               ` Andrew Rybchenko
2021-10-01 12:10                 ` Thomas Monjalon
2021-10-04  9:17                   ` Andrew Rybchenko [this message]
2021-10-04 23:50   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 0/5] Negotiate the NIC's ability to deliver Rx metadata to the PMD Ivan Malov
2021-10-04 23:50     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 1/5] ethdev: negotiate delivery of packet metadata from HW to PMD Ivan Malov
2021-10-05 12:03       ` Ori Kam
2021-10-05 12:50         ` Ivan Malov
2021-10-05 13:17           ` Andrew Rybchenko
2021-10-04 23:50     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 2/5] net/sfc: support API to negotiate delivery of Rx metadata Ivan Malov
2021-10-04 23:50     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 3/5] net/sfc: support flow mark delivery on EF100 native datapath Ivan Malov
2021-10-04 23:50     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 4/5] common/sfc_efx/base: add RxQ flag to use Rx prefix user flag Ivan Malov
2021-10-04 23:50     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v4 5/5] net/sfc: report user flag on EF100 native datapath Ivan Malov
2021-10-05 15:56   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 0/5] ethdev: negotiate the NIC's ability to deliver Rx metadata to the PMD Ivan Malov
2021-10-05 15:56     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 1/5] ethdev: negotiate delivery of packet metadata from HW to PMD Ivan Malov
2021-10-05 21:40       ` Ajit Khaparde
2021-10-06  6:04         ` Somnath Kotur
2021-10-06  6:10           ` Ori Kam
2021-10-06  7:22             ` Wisam Monther
2021-10-05 15:56     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 2/5] net/sfc: support API to negotiate delivery of Rx metadata Ivan Malov
2021-10-05 15:56     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 3/5] net/sfc: support flow mark delivery on EF100 native datapath Ivan Malov
2021-10-05 15:56     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 4/5] common/sfc_efx/base: add RxQ flag to use Rx prefix user flag Ivan Malov
2021-10-05 15:56     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v5 5/5] net/sfc: report user flag on EF100 native datapath Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 18:08       ` Ferruh Yigit
2021-10-12 19:39         ` Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 19:48         ` Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 19:38   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 0/5] ethdev: negotiate the NIC's ability to deliver Rx metadata to the PMD Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 19:38     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 1/5] ethdev: negotiate delivery of packet metadata from HW to PMD Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 19:38     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 2/5] net/sfc: support API to negotiate delivery of Rx metadata Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 19:38     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 3/5] net/sfc: support flow mark delivery on EF100 native datapath Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 19:38     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 4/5] common/sfc_efx/base: add RxQ flag to use Rx prefix user flag Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 19:38     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v6 5/5] net/sfc: report user flag on EF100 native datapath Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 19:46   ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v7 0/5] ethdev: negotiate the NIC's ability to deliver Rx metadata to the PMD Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 19:46     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v7 1/5] ethdev: negotiate delivery of packet metadata from HW to PMD Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 19:46     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v7 2/5] net/sfc: support API to negotiate delivery of Rx metadata Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 19:46     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v7 3/5] net/sfc: support flow mark delivery on EF100 native datapath Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 19:46     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v7 4/5] common/sfc_efx/base: add RxQ flag to use Rx prefix user flag Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 19:46     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v7 5/5] net/sfc: report user flag on EF100 native datapath Ivan Malov
2021-10-12 23:25     ` [dpdk-dev] [PATCH v7 0/5] ethdev: negotiate the NIC's ability to deliver Rx metadata to the PMD Ferruh Yigit

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